Hidden Brain – Passion vs. Paycheck

URL: https://www.inoreader.com/article/3a9c6e776345ae88-passion-vs-paycheck

Host: Shankar Vedantam

Guest: Jennifer Tosti-Karas, Professor at Babson College

Air Date: September 22, 2025

Episode Overview

Marking the 10th anniversary of Hidden Brain, this episode explores the nature of callings—work that feels profoundly meaningful—and their impact on our happiness, creativity, and relationships. Host Shankar Vedantam, joined by researcher Jennifer Tosti-Karas, dissects the benefits and pitfalls of pursuing passion in one’s career through historical examples, psychological research, and cautionary tales.

Key Themes & Discussion Points

1. The Idea of Work as a Calling

Steve Jobs’ Famous Advice
- The episode opens by dissecting Jobs’ 2005 Stanford commencement speech, which still inspires millions to “find what you love.”
  - Quote: “Your time is limited. Don’t waste it living someone else’s life.” – Steve Jobs (02:02)
The language of “calling” once applied chiefly to religious vocations but has since been secularized, leading many to seek similar fulfillment in various fields (03:04).

2. Stories of Lives Transformed (and Distorted) by Callings

Paul Gauguin
- Once a dissatisfied Parisian stockbroker, Gauguin left everything for art in Tahiti, profoundly impacting modern painting yet sacrificing his family and personal wellbeing.
  - Quote: “Paul Gauguin took a move that a lot of us wouldn’t… truly chucked it all, upended his life and moved to Tahiti.” – Jennifer Tosti-Karas (07:48)
Marie Curie
- Marie Curie’s devotion led to groundbreaking scientific discoveries and two Nobel Prizes—yet her work cost her health, possibly causing her death by radiation (12:45).
Oprah Winfrey
- Oprah’s journey, starting from poverty, exemplifies honoring a subtle “whisper” of calling.
  - Quote: “Sometimes the calling is something that was just a whisper to you. And when you begin to honor that…you end up being the best that you could be.” – Oprah Winfrey (13:43)

3. The Psychology and History of Callings

The modern notion of deriving meaning and pleasure from work is quite recent, peaking in popular culture around the early 2000s (18:40).
Tosti-Karas’ research confirms:
- People with strong callings are generally happier, more engaged, and work harder (20:25).
- They display greater resilience during setbacks (22:08).
- Military officers with a strong calling were less likely to feel “plateaued” in their careers (22:43).

4. Downsides of Following a Calling

Distorted Self-Assessment & Tunnel Vision
- Studies of musicians reveal those with strong callings often overestimate their abilities and ignore constructive feedback, sometimes pursuing risky paths unsuited to their talents (32:06, 35:00).
Vulnerability to Exploitation
- Passionate workers are prone to accept lower pay and excessive demands—making them ideal employees, but at serious personal cost (37:20).
  - Quote: “People with stronger callings will actually make financial sacrifices to do the work that they love doing.” – Jennifer Tosti-Karas (38:47)
Burnout and Wellbeing
- Over-commitment leads to higher rates of stress, fatigue, burnout, and health issues (39:00).
Sacrifice to Others
- Pursuing passion may lead to neglecting loved ones (Paul Gauguin), indicating a dark side to single-minded devotion (43:58).
Emotional Fallout When a Calling Fails
- Not realizing a calling (or losing the chance to pursue it) is uniquely painful, often resulting in deep frustration or regret (43:18).

5. Parallels between Callings and Romantic Love

Vedantam draws analogies between the modern quest for meaningful work and for soulmate-style romance: both involve heightened expectations and a risk of disappointment for those who fall short (47:13).
Unattainable ideals—either in work or love—can lead to wide gaps between aspiration and reality, impacting life satisfaction (49:58).

6. Balance and Broader Paths to Meaning

Tosti-Karas cautions that careers need not be the sole source of purpose or worth; there are many paths to a meaningful life, inside and outside work (52:17).
- Quote: “I don’t think that feeling that work is a strong calling is the only path or the best path to feeling that you have a good life or a meaningful life.” – Jennifer Tosti-Karas (52:17)

Memorable Quotes & Moments

Steve Jobs on Vocation:
- “Your work is going to fill a large part of your life, and the only way to be truly satisfied is to do what you believe is great work. And the only way to do great work is to love what you do. If you haven’t found it yet, keep looking and don’t settle.” – 02:43
Callings as Double-Edged Swords:
- “It would be very easy to say... shouldn’t we have a sense that we are, like, I want to do this and nothing’s going to stop me… But... an inability to listen... might harm us.” – Jennifer Tosti-Karas (35:00)
On Exploitation:
- “At what point is it unfair, is it exploitative, and is it pushing into a personal space… that would lead to burnout?” – Jennifer Tosti-Karas (39:00)
On Societal Expectations:
- “I do also want to say I don't think that feeling that work is a strong calling is the only path or the best path to feeling that you have a good life or a meaningful life.… It doesn't only need to be through our work…” – Jennifer Tosti-Karas (52:17)

Timestamps for Key Segments

Opening & Steve Jobs’ Commencement Speech – 00:00–03:04
Paul Gauguin’s Story – 06:11–11:21
Marie Curie & the Costs of Devotion – 11:21–13:28
Oprah Winfrey on Listening to the “Whisper” – 13:28–14:01
What Makes Work Meaningful? – 14:19–15:00; 18:40–20:25
Callings and Engagement, Creativity, and Resilience – 20:25–24:49
Personal Narratives of Calling (Tosti-Karas’ Career Path) – 24:49–28:29
Downsides: Self-Delusion & Exploitation – 32:06–40:31
Emotional Risks & Impact on Others – 43:18–46:05
Parallels with Romantic Love – 47:13–49:58
Societal Implications & Final Reflections – 52:00–54:04

Summary Takeaways

Callings can drive extraordinary achievement, persistence, and satisfaction, but also render individuals susceptible to disappointment, exploitation, and imbalance in life.
The cultural narrative positions “meaningful work” as the holy grail, yet expecting everyone to attain this standard courts widespread frustration.
Meaning and purpose are not the monopoly of career; they can be built through relationships, community, and personal interests.
“Doing what you love” need not come at all costs—balance and critical self-reflection are vital for leading a fulfilling and sustainable life.

For more insights on how to make your work more meaningful—regardless of whether you see it as a calling—look for the companion episode “How to Make Work Meaningful” on Hidden Brain Plus.

It's Not My Fault! - Hidden Brain

https://pod.wave.co/podcast/hidden-brain/its-not-my-fault

Transcript

This is Hidden Brain. I'm Shankar Vedantam. Have you ever noticed when you offer a friend or a colleague or a partner a suggestion for improvement, they often experience an urge to defend themselves rather than listen to how they might change or do something better. They try to preserve the status quo. Like generals fighting a war, they try to protect every square inch of the person they are instead of embracing the person they might become. In our episode last week, Winning the Battle Against Yourself, we looked at how we often fail to make changes in our lives because our best intentions are at odds with what scientists call the value system in the brain. This brain network tends to prioritize the here and now and nudges us toward immediate gratifications instead of long term benefits. If you missed that episode, I'd urge you to go back and listen to it in this podcast feed. Today we look at one of the most powerful reasons we fail to make changes in our lives. Very often the people around us can see what we need to do differently or better. But when they tell us, when they offer us feedback or, heaven forbid, criticism, we respond with anger, with denial, with defensiveness. This is a paradox because many of us also believe we want to live lives of continuous improvement. What better way to improve than to listen to suggestions for improvement? What causes so many of us to feel defensive? How can we listen better to feedback and offer feedback in a manner that will be heard? Overcoming Defensiveness as a way to Improving our lives this week on Hidden Brain.