Talk:Quran/18/109

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== Shaykh Yasir Fahmy reflects on verses 109-110 from Surat al-Kahf. ==

https://youtu.be/RHikfF9dE2w via celebrate mercy [[User:Admin|Admin]] ([[User talk:Admin|talk]]) 10:14, 10 September 2022 (UTC)

== 2024-01-29 ==

http://www.islamitexts.org/quran/18/109#18:109

# [[say]]: "[[if]] [[the]] [[ocean]] [[were]] [[ink]] ([[wherewith]] [[to]] [[write]] [[out]]) [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[sooner]] [[would]] [[the]] [[ocean]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[than]] [[would]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[even]] [[if]] [[we]] [[added]] [[another]] [[ocean]] [[like]] [[it]], [[for]] [[its]] [[aid]]."

# [[say]]: [[though]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[became]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[verily]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[used]] [[up]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[were]] [[exhausted]], [[even]] [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[the]] [[like]] [[thereof]] [[to]] [[help]].

# [[say]]: [[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[surely]] [[be]] [[consumed]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[are]] [[exhausted]], [[though]] [[we]] [[were]] [[to]] [[bring]] [[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[that]] ([[sea]]) [[to]] [[add]]

# [[say]] ([[o]] [[muhammad]] [[saw]] [[to]] [[mankind]]). "[[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] ([[writing]]) [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[surely]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[would]] [[be]] [[finished]], [[even]] [[if]] [[we]] [[brought]] ([[another]] [[sea]]) [[like]] [[it]] [[for]] [[its]] [[aid]]."

# [[say]] [[thou]]: [[were]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[to]] [[become]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[surely]] [[exhaust]] [[ere]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[exhausted]], [[even]] [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[onot]] [[her]] [[like]] [[thereof]] [[for]] [[support]].

# [[say]]: '[[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[surely]] [[be]] [[spent]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[are]] [[spent]], [[even]] [[if]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[its]] [[like]] [[for]] [[replenishment]]. '

# [[say]], `[[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[spent]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[were]] [[spent]], [[even]] [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[in]] [[aid]] [[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[it]]'.

# [[say]], '[[if]] [[every]] [[ocean]] [[become]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[surely]], [[the]] [[ocean]] [[would]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[were]] [[exhausted]], [[even]] [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[the]] [[like]] [[thereof]] [[as]] [[further]] [[help]].'

# [[say]]: "[[if]] [[all]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[my]] [[sustainer's]] [[words]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[indeed]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[ere]] [[my]] [[sustainer's]] [[words]] [[are]] [[exhausted]]! [[and]] [[[thus]] [[it]] [[would]] [[be]]] [[if]] [[we]] [[were]] [[to]] [[add]] [[to]] [[it]] [[sea]] [[upon]] [[sea]]."

#*'' [[lit]]., "[[if]] [[we]] [[were]] [[to]] [[produce]] [[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[it]] [[[i]].[[e]]., [[of]] [[the]] [[sea]]] [[in]] [[addition]]". [[it]] [[is]] [[to]] [[be]] [[noted]] [[that]], [[as]] [[pointed]] [[out]] [[by]] [[zamakhshari]], [[the]] [[term]] [[al]]-[[bahr]] ("[[the]] [[sea]]") [[is]] [[used]] [[here]] [[in]] [[a]] [[generic]] [[sense]], [[comprising]] [[all]] [[the]] [[seas]] [[that]] [[exist]]: [[hence]], [[the]] [[expression]] "[[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[it]]" [[has]] [[been]] [[rendered]] [[by]] [[me]] [[as]] "[[sea]] [[upon]] [[sea]]". ([[see]] [[also]] [[31]]:[[27]].)

# [[say]]:. [[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[spent]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[are]] [[spent]], [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[replenishment]] [[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[it]].

# [[say]]: "[[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[to]] [[become]] [[ink]] [[to]] [[record]] [[the]] [[words]]{{[[80]]}} [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[indeed]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[all]] [[used]] [[up]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[are]] [[exhausted]], [[and]] [[it]] [[would]] [[be]] [[the]] [[same]] [[even]] [[if]] [[we]] [[were]] [[to]] [[bring]] [[an]] [[equal]] [[amount]] [[of]] [[ink]]."

===Shaykh Waleed Basouyi's [https://quranreflect.com/posts/16146 QuranReflection]===

[[this]] [[verse]] [[closes]] [[the]] [[door]] [[of]] [[anyone]] [[who]] [[would]] [[challenge]] [[the]] [[level]] [[of]] [[detail]] [[presented]] [[in]] [[the]] [[quran]], [[the]] [[person]] [[who]] [[says]] "[[thats]] [[it]]? [[thats]] [[all]] [[the]] [[quran]] [[says]] [[about]] [[dhul]] [[qarnayn]]?" [[this]] [[verse]] [[is]] [[as]] [[if]] [[to]] [[say]], "[[there]] [[is]] [[so]] [[much]] [[more]] [[that]] [[could]] [[be]] [[shared]], [[the]] [[detail]] [[about]] [[each]] [[story]] [[and]] [[every]] [[event]] [[and]] [[so]] [[many]] [[other]] [[prophets]], [[events]] [[and]] [[details]] [[that]] [[have]] [[not]] [[been]] [[mentioned]]. [[this]] [[earth]] [[that]] [[is]] [[two]] [[thirds]] [[water]], [[if]] [[all]] [[of]] [[it]] [[were]] [[transformed]] [[into]] [[ink]] [[would]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[twice]] [[over]] [[and]] [[allahs]] [[words]] [[would]] [[not]] [[be]] [[exhausted]]."

Related question/comment: by Ben Zararsiz

Why do the words of Rabb (الرب) differ from the words of Allah (الله)?

[Al-Kahf:109]:

قُل لَّوْ كَانَ الْبَحْرُ مِدَادًا لِّكَلِمَاتِ رَبِّي لَنَفِدَ الْبَحْرُ قَبْلَ أَن تَنفَدَ كَلِمَاتُ رَبِّي وَلَوْ جِئْنَا بِمِثْلِهِ مَدَدًا

Say, "If the sea were ink for [writing] the words of my Lord, the sea would be exhausted before the words of my Lord were exhausted, even if We brought the like of it as a supplement."

— Saheeh International

In this verse, it is stated that the words of the Lord will eventually be exhausted, meaning His words will come to an end. His knowledge is immensely vast, to the extent that even if two entire seas from the Earth were used as ink, His words would not be exhausted before that. It's important to note the word "before" in this context because it signifies that His words will indeed come to an end.

This verse explicitly mentions "Rabb" (الرب) and not "Allah" (الله).

————

[Luqman:27]:

وَلَوْ أَنَّمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ مِن شَجَرَةٍ أَقْلَامٌ وَالْبَحْرُ يَمُدُّهُ مِن بَعْدِهِ سَبْعَةُ أَبْحُرٍ مَّا نَفِدَتْ كَلِمَاتُ اللَّهِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ عَزِيزٌ حَكِيمٌ

And if whatever trees upon the earth were pens and the sea [was ink], replenished thereafter by seven [more] seas, the words of Allah would not be exhausted. Indeed, Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise.

— Saheeh International

In this verse, it is clearly written that the words of Allah will not be exhausted, even if all the oceans on Earth were used as ink sevenfold. This means that, regardless of the quantity of "ink" used, Allah's words have no end.

This verse explicitly mentions "Allah" (اهلل) and not "Rabb" (الرب).

So the question is: Why do the words of Rabb (الرب) differ from the words of Allah?

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
 {{also|Quran/exhausted_ink}}
+==  Shaykh Yasir Fahmy reflects on verses 109-110 from Surat al-Kahf. ==
+https://youtu.be/RHikfF9dE2w via celebrate mercy [[User:Admin|Admin]] ([[User talk:Admin|talk]]) 10:14, 10 September 2022 (UTC)
+== 2024-01-29 ==
+http://www.islamitexts.org/quran/18/109#18:109
+# [[say]]: "[[if]] [[the]] [[ocean]] [[were]] [[ink]] ([[wherewith]] [[to]] [[write]] [[out]]) [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[sooner]] [[would]] [[the]] [[ocean]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[than]] [[would]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[even]] [[if]] [[we]] [[added]] [[another]] [[ocean]] [[like]] [[it]], [[for]] [[its]] [[aid]]."
+# [[say]]: [[though]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[became]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[verily]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[used]] [[up]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[were]] [[exhausted]], [[even]] [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[the]] [[like]] [[thereof]] [[to]] [[help]].
+# [[say]]: [[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[surely]] [[be]] [[consumed]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[are]] [[exhausted]], [[though]] [[we]] [[were]] [[to]] [[bring]] [[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[that]] ([[sea]]) [[to]] [[add]]
+# [[say]] ([[o]] [[muhammad]] [[saw]] [[to]] [[mankind]]). "[[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] ([[writing]]) [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[surely]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[would]] [[be]] [[finished]], [[even]] [[if]] [[we]] [[brought]] ([[another]] [[sea]]) [[like]] [[it]] [[for]] [[its]] [[aid]]."
+# [[say]] [[thou]]: [[were]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[to]] [[become]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[surely]] [[exhaust]] [[ere]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[exhausted]], [[even]] [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[onot]] [[her]] [[like]] [[thereof]] [[for]] [[support]].
+# [[say]]: '[[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[surely]] [[be]] [[spent]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[are]] [[spent]], [[even]] [[if]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[its]] [[like]] [[for]] [[replenishment]]. '
+# [[say]], `[[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[spent]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[were]] [[spent]], [[even]] [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[in]] [[aid]] [[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[it]]'.
+# [[say]], '[[if]] [[every]] [[ocean]] [[become]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[surely]], [[the]] [[ocean]] [[would]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[were]] [[exhausted]], [[even]] [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[the]] [[like]] [[thereof]] [[as]] [[further]] [[help]].'
+# [[say]]: "[[if]] [[all]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[my]] [[sustainer's]] [[words]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[indeed]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[ere]] [[my]] [[sustainer's]] [[words]] [[are]] [[exhausted]]! [[and]] [[[thus]] [[it]] [[would]] [[be]]] [[if]] [[we]] [[were]] [[to]] [[add]] [[to]] [[it]] [[sea]] [[upon]] [[sea]]."
+#*'' [[lit]]., "[[if]] [[we]] [[were]] [[to]] [[produce]] [[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[it]] [[[i]].[[e]]., [[of]] [[the]] [[sea]]] [[in]] [[addition]]". [[it]] [[is]] [[to]] [[be]] [[noted]] [[that]], [[as]] [[pointed]] [[out]] [[by]] [[zamakhshari]], [[the]] [[term]] [[al]]-[[bahr]] ("[[the]] [[sea]]") [[is]] [[used]] [[here]] [[in]] [[a]] [[generic]] [[sense]], [[comprising]] [[all]] [[the]] [[seas]] [[that]] [[exist]]: [[hence]], [[the]] [[expression]] "[[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[it]]" [[has]] [[been]] [[rendered]] [[by]] [[me]] [[as]] "[[sea]] [[upon]] [[sea]]". ([[see]] [[also]] [[31]]:[[27]].)
+# [[say]]:. [[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[ink]] [[for]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[spent]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[are]] [[spent]], [[though]] [[we]] [[brought]] [[replenishment]] [[the]] [[like]] [[of]] [[it]].
+# [[say]]: "[[if]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[were]] [[to]] [[become]] [[ink]] [[to]] [[record]] [[the]] [[words]]{{[[80]]}} [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]], [[indeed]] [[the]] [[sea]] [[would]] [[be]] [[all]] [[used]] [[up]] [[before]] [[the]] [[words]] [[of]] [[my]] [[lord]] [[are]] [[exhausted]], [[and]] [[it]] [[would]] [[be]] [[the]] [[same]] [[even]] [[if]] [[we]] [[were]] [[to]] [[bring]] [[an]] [[equal]] [[amount]] [[of]] [[ink]]."
+===Shaykh Waleed Basouyi's [https://quranreflect.com/posts/16146 QuranReflection]===
+[[this]] [[verse]] [[closes]] [[the]] [[door]] [[of]] [[anyone]] [[who]] [[would]] [[challenge]] [[the]] [[level]] [[of]] [[detail]] [[presented]] [[in]] [[the]] [[quran]], [[the]] [[person]] [[who]] [[says]] "[[thats]] [[it]]? [[thats]] [[all]] [[the]] [[quran]] [[says]] [[about]] [[dhul]] [[qarnayn]]?" [[this]] [[verse]] [[is]] [[as]] [[if]] [[to]] [[say]], "[[there]] [[is]] [[so]] [[much]] [[more]] [[that]] [[could]] [[be]] [[shared]], [[the]] [[detail]] [[about]] [[each]] [[story]] [[and]] [[every]] [[event]] [[and]] [[so]] [[many]] [[other]] [[prophets]], [[events]] [[and]] [[details]] [[that]] [[have]] [[not]] [[been]] [[mentioned]]. [[this]] [[earth]] [[that]] [[is]] [[two]] [[thirds]] [[water]], [[if]] [[all]] [[of]] [[it]] [[were]] [[transformed]] [[into]] [[ink]] [[would]] [[be]] [[exhausted]] [[twice]] [[over]] [[and]] [[allahs]] [[words]] [[would]] [[not]] [[be]] [[exhausted]]."
+Related question/comment: by Ben Zararsiz
+Why do the words of Rabb (الرب) differ from the words of Allah (الله)?
+[Al-Kahf:109]:
+قُل لَّوْ كَانَ الْبَحْرُ مِدَادًا لِّكَلِمَاتِ رَبِّي لَنَفِدَ الْبَحْرُ قَبْلَ أَن تَنفَدَ كَلِمَاتُ رَبِّي وَلَوْ جِئْنَا بِمِثْلِهِ مَدَدًا
+Say, "If the sea were ink for [writing] the words of my Lord, the sea would be exhausted before the words of my Lord were exhausted, even if We brought the like of it as a supplement."
+— Saheeh International
+In this verse, it is stated that the words of the Lord will eventually be exhausted, meaning His words will come to an end. His knowledge is immensely vast, to the extent that even if two entire seas from the Earth were used as ink, His words would not be exhausted before that. It's important to note the word "before" in this context because it signifies that His words will indeed come to an end.
+This verse explicitly mentions "Rabb" (الرب) and not "Allah" (الله).
+————
+[Luqman:27]:
+وَلَوْ أَنَّمَا فِي الْأَرْضِ مِن شَجَرَةٍ أَقْلَامٌ وَالْبَحْرُ يَمُدُّهُ مِن بَعْدِهِ سَبْعَةُ أَبْحُرٍ مَّا نَفِدَتْ كَلِمَاتُ اللَّهِ إِنَّ اللَّهَ عَزِيزٌ حَكِيمٌ
+And if whatever trees upon the earth were pens and the sea [was ink], replenished thereafter by seven [more] seas, the words of Allah would not be exhausted. Indeed, Allah is Exalted in Might and Wise.
+— Saheeh International
+In this verse, it is clearly written that the words of Allah will not be exhausted, even if all the oceans on Earth were used as ink sevenfold. This means that, regardless of the quantity of "ink" used, Allah's words have no end.
+This verse explicitly mentions "Allah" (اهلل) and not "Rabb" (الرب).
+So the question is: Why do the words of Rabb (الرب) differ from the words of Allah?